Axel Abysse: "If God exists and designed us, we will have to thank him: it was well hidden but it was worth digging!"

     A few days ago I had the chance to exchange a few emails with Axel Abysse to ask him a few (many) questions about his background and the way he envisions his artistic and personal activities. The interview is long but allowed us to talk about many subjects, from sexuality in all its forms with as many fluids as possible, to his training or his university education in cinema.

Original version in French here.

Axel Abysse photographed by UTO

LE RECTUM: To begin, could you introduce yourself quickly for those who don't know you?

AXEL ABYSSE: My name is Axel Abysse, porn director and performer specializing in fist-fucking. I am French, based in Tokyo, Japan for ten years. I direct and/or produce most of the films on my AxelAbysse.com platform launched in 2017.

A short biography is available on your website. We learn that you drew as a child and that your practice, as your puberty progressed, was oriented towards pornographic drawings. Can you tell us about this period and these drawings? (if we could see some that would be great!)

I have reviewed these drawings recently and they are of little interest to the public. But there were already recurring themes in my current work, in particular my obsessive relationship with fluids: ocean, piss...

It seems to me that you were born and raised in the countryside, in France. How was the discovery of your sexuality and the beginning of your sex life?

I was very sexual very young. For a long time I felt very alone because I didn't know any other gay people, I had no one to confide in or identify with. My sexuality was formed through the trashy porn I watched on the sly and a huge dose of imagination.

We also learn that you experienced fisting from the age of 18. I was born in the 1990s and my sex life was largely shaped by Grindr. Can you explain us how an 18 year old boy who grew up in the countryside ends up getting fisted so early?

I started alone with my own hand. Out of pure curiosity, but also out of a desire to explore taboos. At 18, I left the countryside for university. I finally started to meet other perverts.

How was this first experience? Was it a first experience among many others or did it mark you instantly and lastingly?

The first time someone fisted me was an act of love. My first real orgasm. A revelation. The kind of upheaval you never recover from, my life changed that day.

Yukio Mishima photographed by Hosoe Eikoh (from the series 薔薇刑 Barakei (The Torment of Roses)) in 1963

What then led you to move to Japan?

I have always been a fan of Japanese pop culture. Or at least what I knew about it through the prism of the French media, then I discovered the writer Yukio Mishima and finally Japanese cinema and its new wave. My first visit was love at first sight. There was also of course this desire elsewhere. I have always sought to explore new worlds, whether in fiction or more concrete.

Japan is a country that interests me a lot too. However, it is clear that he is not known for his action in favor of sexual minorities. In Les Chrysanthèmes Roses, Erick Laurent presents Japan as a non-homophobic society but one that completely invisibilizes the people concerned; which sounds a lot like homophobia. Nevertheless, we can note that, recently, some prefectures have begun to recognize a homosexual union. How was your arrival in Japan as a gay man? How do you live today as a gay man living from gay sex work?

The subject is more complex than that but it would be necessary to discuss it with Japanese people. Before being gay, I appear as a foreigner, who is moreover white. I favor a certain freedom to act without being judged. Social and family pressure is heavy here and my status allowed me for a long time not to have to meet the responsibilities imposed on Japanese homosexuals. When it comes to sex work, it's a gray area. I travel a lot and my porn is distributed elsewhere. My life in Japan is ultimately independent of my career.

Was there (and is there) a fisting, or perhaps more broadly fetishist, scene particular to Japan?

Sure. It is very discreet, everything is underground and you have to be initiated. But a few friends and I are trying to make it grow.

Your artistic practice then evolved towards photography. Were you still drawing at that time? Has your practice of photography always been exclusively pornographic? How do you view your photographic and drawn works from before 2014 today?

I still touch a bit of everything when time allows me. I do not take too much interest in my past work, but it is a constant evolution. Themes repeat themselves, points of view and techniques change. Today my porn production consumes most of my energy and inspiration, in a positive way. Who knows where this will take me in the future?

In 2014 you post your first video on Xtube. What is your situation at this time? Do you think you will embark on a substantial work (career? I don't know which word is the most appropriate)?

It was never a goal. I made my first videos to show off while training in video editing, which for me is a real tool of expression.

You explain it's after this video that a fan community forms around you. It reminds me of the movie King Cobra recounting the beginnings of Brent Corrigan in 2004. How was this community created? How did you welcome and see this community of fans grow?

I did not see anything coming. Some videos have gone viral on Tumblr in particular, without me really realizing it. At the time everyone posted excerpts from videos without crediting anyone. But my only desire was to show off my open ass, so mission accomplished!

This is also when you start referring to your anus as a curse. Can you tell us about that? Is this also the beginning of the use of the name Axel Abysse?

Probably. I'm not sure of the timeline anymore. I was trying to define the power my hole has over me. It's almost an entity in its own right, an appetite that I have to feed constantly. When the hole is satisfied, I feel an intense joy, a form of fullness. But it is also very complicated to manage to satisfy it. He always wants more, all the time, all the time. I sometimes have to slip away to stir up hunger in the toilet in inappropriate places or times. Whoever manages to destroy my ass completely will free me!

Internet exposure often involves loved ones and family. Did this exhibition have repercussions (good or bad) on your private life?

No, I am protected by my relatives who support me on the contrary. I am very lucky.

Axel Abysse and Bruce Bang for Club Inferno Dungeon (2015)

The rest of the story is obviously the interest for you of the biggest porn studios. How did this contact happen? How was this evolution from personal to professional videos in studios with the pressure that the job entails?

Folks at Club Inferno reached out to me on XTube after one of my videos was successful. They invited me to go film in Las Vegas. It is indeed a lot of work, more than most people imagine and I never had and still do not have the ambition to be a “porn star”. But sharing my ass and my passion for fist-fucking with as many people as possible has always been my motivation. Today, with my production, it's still the same desire, but I try to use the studio cogs as little as possible. No script, no staging, I want the sex to be authentic and my films are a way of documenting rather than telling.

Buck Angel (unknown photographer)

You indicate a meeting, Buck Angel in 2017, as being decisive in your life choices. Can you explain it to us?

Buck was an idol, I had seen his films for years. I had never seen a trans man before him in porn, he opened my eyes to many subjects, obviously trans identity, the place of the penis in sexuality… I met him during Tokyo Pride. After showing him some of my videos, he was the one who convinced me to launch my site. I had never considered it. I didn't think I could make a career out of it. He believed in me and I am forever grateful to him.

Even today you regularly present your anus as a curse. Especially with this magnificent sentence My hole is my curse. We must destroy it so I can find serenity. What is your relationship to religion, to the sacred and how do your practices, especially fisting, fit into this search for serenity (spirituality?)?

Fisting can be quite ritualistic in its practice. We played with it for the performance 'Rencontre CULturelle' in Seoul, Korea. My body and my ass sacrificed on an altar.

I'm not religious, it's a simple irreverence, a provocation that pleases me.

But the practice of fisting actually gives me sensations that I find nowhere else, sometimes relaxing, sometimes overwhelming. Intense orgasms made me cry or burst out laughing sometimes. It's an exploration of the body, looking for weak or strong points, which trigger like some kind of secret mechanism to deploy endorphins in the brain, like a bug in the system. If God exists and designed us, we will have to thank him: it was well hidden but it was worth digging!

A few years ago, I was looking for practices that were more and more hardcore, dirty, amateur. And then I came across one of your videos. Your anus was swallowing a huge plug with an incredible, shiny, intense aesthetic. This video struck me with the contrast of practice and beauty, control that I had never seen before. What do you look for when shooting a video?

Even the dirty is beautiful. I am both a fister and a videographer, these are two interrelated passions for me. I want to be able to transcribe what makes me come. The rawness of the words, the piss that erupts without warning, the faces that tense up in orgasm, the crazy eyes, the spasms... I never want to impress, I'm not interested in competing for the biggest, the longest , of the largest. Above all, I want to capture desire and pleasure, and for that the connection between two partners who trust each other before penetrating each other.

Some of your videos evoke a slow, almost meditative and transcendental practice of fisting, others show a much more violent and wild practice of fisting. Is the second the logical continuation of the first or are they totally different times?

Absolutely not. Fist-fucking has countless forms. Each session is unique and cannot be repeated. A fister will discover and develop preferences, in terms of depth, width or cadence for example, which are specific to his body and his personal tastes, but these are constantly evolving and also depend on the context, the partner, energy… I tend to prefer punch, I like having my hole punched. But it is never an objective, never an obligation. It's all about good times and trust. My partner may prefer to slowly search my intestine and it is together that we will compose our session, communicating, exploring together. Very recently, I was exhausted after a long journey, my body only receptive to the sweetness of a hunger that was slowly creeping into me. I pissed myself as his wrist swung around and gently rubbed my prostate gently. Total ecstasy.

From Abyssal Gang Bang (2019)

The filming of Abyssal Gang Bang at the Keller seems to have been particularly intense. Can you tell us how this film was born and shot? Watching this film, I have the impression of seeing on the screen a sensation, a fantasy, which I had several times while masturbating, often for hours, of total abandonment of oneself, the supreme ecstasy of slut leaving her body at the mercy of the savagery of the guys, no longer controlling anything, fucked and fisted to the extreme in a fed up of piss and cum.

Probably the most intense actually. It was a huge fantasy for me, just being a hole at the mercy of strangers who use me to come. I had opened registration to everyone for a session at the Keller. The guys knew what awaited them. Two cameramen, a few rules of consent and security of course, but the message was clear: "come and fuck my pussy, I'm available to everyone". And that's exactly what these twelve guys did. I hope to do it again one day, when the pandemic will be a distant memory.

From Abyssal Gang Bang (2019)

From Urges - Performance backstage live at Taipei Pride 2018

From Water Bridge (2018)

What do you have to do with piss?

Piss is my champagne. I am a urinal. I drink it, I cover myself with it, I let it dry on my clothes that I don't wash, and I have a weakness for the humiliating moments when I can't hold myself back and my bladder lets go in public. It happened several times before it became a fetish. Freud would have so many things to say about me.

Poster of Piss Off: The Performance Art of Athleticpisspig (2019)

You participated in the documentary Piss Off: The Performance Art of Athleticpisspig in 2019. The film seems to have received a very good reception. Could you tell us about this documentary and the work of Athleticpisspig?

Director Henry Baker contacted me to interview me. Athleticpisspig and I have several videos together and he wanted to know my perspective as a sex worker I guess. APP is a fetishist who doesn't think about his videos, he just documents his pissing sessions in public. It's his fantasy and he doesn't make any money from his videos at all. The documentary tells all that precisely, and won many awards, it surprised us a lot. It's fascinating.

From Anani 15 (2021)

Have you been (or are you still) close to the piercings, tattoos, body modifications scenes? Is pain particularly important to you?

I have no attraction to pain per se but I am obsessed with body modifications. I started getting pierced very early. Just got my first tattoo, turquoise hoops on my left arm, the start of a longer project. I have a weakness for tongues and sliced ​​tails… My urethra is already well under way, which allows me to finger my glans. Who knows where I would stop.

Your approach and some of your films sometimes remind me of the performance work of Ron Athey. A search for transcendence, perhaps a form of holiness, of spiritual elevation through fisting. Am I off the mark?

I'm flattered, but I don't stage my films, or very little of them. When I film, I don't know what the film will look like because the sex is totally improvised. I do all my editing, so gimmicks may creep into the way I cut and stitch my films… but I have no intention of touching the sacred, only the sex itself might have the power to bring up this, but it's totally out of my control. 

Ron Athey's HIV status was decisive in his career. On your site, your manifesto includes a section devoted to sexual health and in particular to the issue of HIV. An accessible and educational paragraph on the practice of fisting, the risks incurred and their proportions as well as methods to protect oneself from them. You encourage people to get tested, know their HIV status and that of their partner and talk about Prep. Finally, you clearly express your position: mandatory and non-negotiable gloves, without any judgment of other practices as long as they are agreed and taken knowingly. In my opinion, it is a text and a position that honors you. This theme of sexual health is still essential but is quite far from the showcase of the porn industry. How did you approach this reality of the lack of protection and information in the pornographic environment? Have you seen any changes since you started (good or bad)?

Recently the documentary 売買ボーイズ | BOYS FOR SALE explored male prostitution in Japan. The result is a rather sad observation of a glaring lack of information and tools for prevention and contraception. Do you make the same observation? If so, how did you come across this difficult, sometimes non-existent access to sexual health?

I am not a doctor and I have sometimes had times when my discourse on drugs and prevention has been almost paternalistic. I try today to nuance my speech, to learn and educate myself without judging. The situation in Japan is dramatic with little or no access to Prep in particular. Many young guys in Tokyo saunas don't protect themselves because they watch bareback porn, but they are unaware of the risks. There is a real lack of sex education and supervision. Fortunately, associations are doing the job. The government doesn't care about it at all. This is why it is important to me to lead by example. I too have released several bareback scenes more recently, and I try to prevent and explain the conditions of such a practice.

You continually gravitate between a pornographic sphere and an artistic sphere. How would you define your job?

The mistake is to think that pornographic and artistic are two separate things. Porn is a genre of cinema, which has its subgenres. The artistic can exist in any form, and it is not necessarily about the beautiful. I like neat images, colors that express an emotion and I try to incorporate that into my work.

I should have been more precise when talking about the porn industry and artistic practices (the limits can be very vague). In my opinion, the dividing line lies in the fact that the primary goal of the artistic act is not financial, unlike an industrial activity (here pornographic) whose goal (first or even unique) is to earn a salary. There's no moral judgment behind it all, what I'm trying to bring out is the need for expression. Is that how you started showing off on Xtube and maybe that's why you don't depend on a big studio?

For me, it’s like any form of cinema. You can earn money but it is above all guided by the desire to create, to express. As in Hollywood, the bigger the production, the more the film is staged, played, overplayed… In the cinema too, I prefer auteur, independent films. In music too, my favorite artists are those who compose their songs themselves, who play their instruments, who write their texts…

From Mucin (2021)

Your latest film, Mucin, has just been released. A collaboration with photographer Manbo Key, artist Jr Shin Lou and… snails that started in 2019. Can you tell us about the project? The snails remind me of this series of drawings by Mavado Charon around slugs for his fanzine SlugFest (2017). You know ?

I didn't know at all but I like it a lot! For this collaboration, I just wanted to give carte blanche to Manbo, a Taiwanese photographer whose work I admire, and his collaborators. The film is a hallucination, some have read a tale in it, others see it as a series of paintings, others simply enjoyed it. I like to mix genres and push my porn to new limits. For this, the collaboration with artists from different social-cultural universes becomes obvious. Manbo has done covers for Vogue in Asia, several exhibitions, he has his own aesthetic and I trusted him completely. I am very proud of our common project. It seems that several international festivals are interested and I can't wait to show the film to a different audience.

Unused drawing from the serie Slugfest by Mavado Charon (2017)

From Slugfest by Mavado Charon (2017)

Fragile by Pierre et Gilles (2007)

Kosmic Sans wearing a bubble wrap dress and ribbons "handle with ware" (2021)

When I see movies like Handle with Care, I can't help noticing the work done on aesthetics. I immediately had in mind this photo of Pierre de Gilles. What are your inspirations concerning the atmosphere, the decorations and their creation?

It is true that it is very close! I had rather thought of Dexter for once, but also inspired by a dress of the drag queen Kosmic Sans in bubble wrap and ‘Handle with care’ taps.

From Handle with care (2021)

Pierre Rubberax and Axel Abysse, from Sleek (2020)

In 2020 you collaborated with a young French actor that I have followed since his debut, Pierre Rubberax. You then filmed it in Trouble this year. How did this meeting happen?

We followed each other on social media, I think. He had never fisted before… He seems to like it!

From Freedive (2020)

While reading your blog, I came across this wonderful video, Freedive. Fisting and masturbation to discover the aquatic fauna of southern Japan: how did you come up with this idea?

Simply a fantasy. I have been diving for a very long time, the ocean is my element. It was obvious to me, I didn't really think about it.

From The Shore (2020)

A number of your videos take place outdoors, do you have any anecdotes in which you found yourself in funny situations?

While filming "The Shore" with Asher Hattori on a deserted beach, our fisting session was interrupted by a guy appearing out of nowhere, also naked. He introduced himself, a traveler, he was camping behind a dune. He was straight but asked if he could observe the filming. We let him do it, I'm still excited at the idea of ​​being observed. At the end, he complimented us on the show! He seemed very surprised at what our bodies could do, but without any judgment. It was a funny meeting.

What do you think of this young new emerging scene (and amateur in a good way) fetish, latex, sportswear especially present on Twitter, Instagram and OnlyFans?

I think the scene has always existed but it takes a different form and extends beyond its borders thanks to social networks. It's really inspiring to see the creativity of some kinksters. I have a preference for all those who play and break the codes of gender, color, virility...

More recently you filmed Ag, a film during which we see Shusaku fucking and fisting Yoshi Kawasaki while they are completely covered in silver paint. The photography is magnificent: metallic angels during a manly ritual. The contrast created, for example with the red and white of Yoshi's filled ass is superb. How is this kind of filming going? Is it a particular paint that is used? By searching a bit I thought I understood that there was a gay porn scene around body painting in Japan.

I love working with Yoshi and Nohara Shusaku. As with my film 'The Experiment', the concept came from Shusaku who is an endless source of references and ideas, both traditional and purely sexual. It is exciting. There is indeed a lot of preparation for this kind of shooting, but once they start, they go wild and it's up to me, as the cameraman, to capture most of the action, the suspended moments, the nuggets…

I recently listened to your interview for the On The Verge podcast (2020), you talk quickly about your college career in film. What are your main sources of cinematic inspiration?

Among my star directors: David Lynch, Yasujiro Ozu, Gaspar Noé…

What is your relationship to video material? Are you still tinkering with cameras? Do you regularly change equipment? Are technical innovations like 3D something that interests you and that you follow closely?

I am a self-taught videographer, but technically I prefer editing to filming. Filming limits my imagination and often frustrates me, while editing gives me the power to transform everything. I observe new technologies but I myself am not the type to change my equipment every two months.

Regarding 3D, I look a lot at the work of artists like Animopron. Modeling, like animation, breaks down the boundaries of reality. I would like one day to collaborate in this field, to get fucked in a surreal universe by unthinkable creatures...

Your work is very focused on the desire to film the real thing, to document practices. Could you, one day, embark on a documentary on this so-called extreme sexuality (fisting, uro, gang bang, etc.)?

I can't see myself doing that. On the other hand, fiction, beyond porn, would interest me a lot. One day.

Personally, have your practices and your career influenced your relationships with others in your personal life? Do you strictly separate professional and personal world? Are you looking for the stability of a "traditional couple" or do your activities give you the opportunity to escape this pattern to try others?

Fisting is a way of life, I breathe to get fisted. There are people like Yoshi who are both professional and personal, he is one of my best friends today, and we also fuck in private.

I am also married to Kosmic Sans but not sure that we can consider my couple as "traditional".

From the cover of Kick ii album by Arca (2021)

Are there any artists, performers, works that have marked you recently? Anything to recommend?

Arca and her albums Kick i, ii, iii, iiii and iiiii. She has haunted me for years. It perfectly encompasses my vision of modern pop culture and inspires me every day.

I'm also a big fan of Arca, it's the Mutant album that marked me a lot. I really find that it oozes homosexual desire. It's an album that meant a lot to me. At the same time, I remember having discovered the existence of the film Bottom by Todd Verow.

Arca is trans and I really believe that the desire that transpires through her compositions goes far beyond homosexuality. An elevation of the carnal that can speak to everyone...

Finally, is there anything you would like to talk about that we haven't talked about so far?

I don't think so, we covered a lot of topics!

Thank you very much.

With pleasure !

Axel publishes regularly on his website as well as on his Twitter account.